Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
Hey, welcome, everyone, to another episode of the Jonathan Project Podcast, where iron is sharpening iron and we are helping men navigate this complex world around them. And we take the inspiration for this show from Jonathan and his great friend and future king David. If you have found any inspiration, you listen to this, you're a new listener. You can reach out to me and Jason at the Jonathan Project podcast gmail.com for prayer listening events that you have, anything that you have going on out there that you think that we might be a good captive speaking group for, please reach out to us at the Jonathan Project podcastmail.com We also have a free devotional.
Believe it or not, in this day and age, you can still get something for free. And this is all goodness. 28 days of helping you improve yourself as a man. Some of those key titles we have as husbands and fathers. So look for that in the episode summary. Jason, welcome to yet another show. How are you doing?
[00:01:09] Speaker B: Hey, buddy. I'm doing well. How about yourself?
[00:01:12] Speaker A: I'm. I'm doing good. Tired. Got a lot going on as always, but we're gonna.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:01:18] Speaker A: Get on through and soldier through.
[00:01:21] Speaker B: No, I hear you. We just got back from vacation. Very blessed to be able to take one, so I feel a lot more refreshed than you do. I'll just.
[00:01:30] Speaker A: It's all good. So we got an interesting topic here today. You know, I think we've all had a falling out with someone at some point in time, but it really hits different when it's a Christian brother. So we're going to talk to you guys about, you know, when there's disagreements in God's kingdom. Jason, you want to go ahead and take us away?
[00:01:51] Speaker B: So I'm in the book of Acts, right? And it's in Acts 15.
And the story's also kind of elaborated on in Galatians 2 for those who are turning there right now. Carmen. So as you get there, Paul and Peter have a disagreement, and then later, Paul and Barnabas have a disagreement, right? It's like there were people that were trying to get the Christians, new Christians, the.
To live under the Jewish law. And it comes down to a lot of. It comes down to circumcision, right?
Got to be circumcised.
And Paul is not having any of it in this discussion.
He's also having, you know, because they're like, hey, don't, don't do this, don't do that. Kind of gotta. We need you to blend into the Jewish community. Community.
And Paul says, nope, it's all grace. It's Jesus Christ and nothing else.
And so there is that disagreement. As a matter of fact, it's interesting. Paul says in Galatians 2 that Titus was a Gentile and he was not asked to be circumcised. When Paul went and talked to, you know, the members of the church there, I think it was Peter, John and James.
James, Jesus's brother. Yeah.
So there's this disappointment. And Paul comes up and he says, I addressed Peter to his face.
Now, Paul's a passionate guy and he was pretty defiant.
And I think as Christians, you know, we think we're on the side of. Right. I've noticed that a lot. Right. Like, everybody believes they're right.
So he comes to him and he talks.
And Paul was pretty defiant over two things.
When you kind of read the story, it was about Christ alone, period. That's was a doctrinal issue.
And it was about. This is segregating the church.
We're dividing the church.
In past episodes, you know, we talked about division being the enemy's number one strategy.
So those were.
Those were things. I think that when you look at it, you know, Peter and him had this discussion. When you look at conflict, there's a great definition out there. It's an express struggle. Right. But it boils down to these two things. Either one, scarce resources. So grace is free and abundant. So that wasn't it.
But also incompatible goals.
Right. That incompatibility.
And I like how Paul and Peter talked about it.
They. They got together, they talked face to face.
Those are some of the things that kind of went through my head.
[00:04:41] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it's, you know, disagreement is one of those. It's just one of those strange things I think about.
When I was, you know, a little bit younger, I was in company command, my second command, and I had a headquarters company, which you don't have. You go from being a line combat guy to being in charge of a bunch of staffers and weird stray MOS's and cats and dogs, so to speak. And I remember the Scouts was one of the kind of action platoons I had. And I had. I was told, like, hey, you got to give them up to, you know, one of these line companies. And. And then. And I didn't really kind of agree with the company commander, the way he kind of just moved about in life and. And there was this disagreement. I was like, no, I. I will rather be in charge of them. And I had to come to understand with some help of some more senior people that, you know, it's not about You. It's about the team. And inevitably, when you look at this conflict between Paul and Barnabas, you get a lot of that as well, that there is this inerrant nature where even in Christian ranks you can think that your brother's wrong and you're right and vice versa. But I love. There's a little nuance in the Bible that kind of shows in this story in particular, you know, I kind of focused on the Paul and Barnabas part, was that the Bible doesn't make it clear who was right or who was wrong.
And anytime that you see a little bit of silence from. From God and what he shows us in the Bible, it's just a lesson and a teaching point for us that, you know, out of that conflict, it doesn't necessarily mean either one of them was wrong. They had a point and they, you know, and that God was going to use them in different ways. Maybe it was just time to move on. So. So, you know, how we handle, you know, disagreement. This inevitable thing really speaks to our maturity and. And our witness as. As kingdom men and followers of Jesus.
[00:06:34] Speaker B: You know, even. And Paul wrote in Galatians, he said, even Barnabas was kind of persuaded by that thought of let's get back under the law, which I think you're. You're, you know, maybe that also fueled the fire. But all. It's kind of interesting in Acts, it talks about Paul and Barnabas, let's go see our brethren, right? And he wants to take John Mark, and that's kind of how they had this initial thing. And then it goes. But I think in any. In both those instances, conflict doesn't have to be bad.
It's either, you know, it's either internal or external conflict.
Internal conflict is dysfunction and it's counterproductive work behavior. And that's what Paul was. And Peter as well as Barnabas were, I think they were trying to get away from. And they realized the external conflict was there was their carrying the gospel into the world, that light, you know, piercing the darkness.
That was stronger. That. That made them stronger. Because if you look later, I think Paul even, you know, he. He says some very positive things about Barnabas. He says positive things about Peter in his last epistle. He says, hey, send John Mark to me. He's of a great use to the test, you know, to the ministry.
But, you know, when conflict comes, I like what you said, you've got to find that common ground and you got to make it not internal but external, you know, because Satan is there to steal, to steal. And Deceive and destroy.
And if he can create a division in the church, that's exactly what he wants.
I think, you know, as mature Christians, we really have to take a pause and go, look, let's, let's think about this. Is it my feelings that hurt or we. Is the fight about me or is it about the Gospel?
[00:08:35] Speaker A: Sure.
No, I, I think, I think you're absolutely right. And it takes a lot of maturity to learn how not to quarrel and argue over every little thing which is so common nowadays. It's just so disheartening that, you know, you drive down the road, you read the back of people's cars and it's already, people are already looking for disagreement like disagreeability and the, the, the seeking out like that is so sinful that you're seeking out to quarrel with someone over, over whatever it is, all kinds of tribal with things, right? And, and I'm sure everyone has seen that. But the amazing thing with the Bible, and when you dive into it and you let the Holy Spirit start working on you and, and pulling out some of that dross and, and skimming it off that we all have inside of us. Matthew 5, 23, 24 talks about this point that we've talked about several times on the show, which is reconciliation, and in particular in this scripture, reconciliation before worship. You can't go before the King of kings and try to worship him when you haven't reconciled with your brother. You know, you can't hate someone and say that you love Jesus. Right? It just, it doesn't match up. And I think sometimes we miss that as God's Romans 12:18 try to, you know, I'm paraphrasing here a little bit, but live at peace with everyone.
That doesn't mean you have to agree with their lifestyle. But in like we see in this case with Paul and Barn, this is like, hey, we're going to agree, and this is the ultimate and the right way. We're going to agree to disagree. You see it this way, I see it that way. But I love you as a brother and we're going to go our separate ways and let God really be that judge in between you. I think too often nowadays, because everyone has a soapbox they carry around in their hands and they can, and they can say something that we want to be judge, jury and executioner.
And you're forgetting that, you know, you have a big stone pointed, you know, someone could throw back at you in the second Timothy 2 and 24, don't quarrel. Be gentle and patient.
We sometimes Attribute. If I don't get the word in, I'm not a man.
If I don't say something back, you know, you know, he got the better of me or she got the better of me. I have to be disagreeable in this moment. I have to let them know that my tribe, my view, my company pick something is right and that's not biblical. Sometimes the best thing you can do. The most golly thing I've done sometimes is I've just gotten up and walked out of a room.
[00:11:02] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:11:03] Speaker A: In my head and walking. Me and the Lord have had a very blunt and open conversation. And I'm sure all you guys and gals can understand that and God understands it. But it's better than me sitting there going through all this emotion and losing my. My witness with someone that it's not even worth it.
[00:11:20] Speaker B: You know, I think we.
So as a leader and as a more mature Christian, you have to recognize the conflict. Right. Like, you have to assess it and go, is it. Is it functional or dysfunctional? And I think you have to fix the problem and not the blame. That's a mature Christian. Because ultimately we're in this together to further the gospel. And that's what Paul and Peter, as well as Paul and Barnabas, you know, they split over John Mark, which might have been a good. Maybe that's one of the methods that God spurs growth or spurs you to move on. Right. Like personality conflicts.
And, you know, I mean, we've all had them, you know, and you have them in church.
As the older I've gotten, I've tried to find.
Let's focus on the gospel.
What's the. How do we both win?
But, you know, Paul says in. In his gospel, and I'm paraphrasing it, the split there, he's like, hey, John Mark, he left us once. I'm going to preach the gospel. That guy's going to slow us down.
All right. And Barnabas says, hey, I want to take some time and mentor this guy and grow him.
[00:12:31] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:12:31] Speaker B: So they're both right.
Yeah, they really are.
And what the result of that was is the gospel spread twice as fast.
Right. But when they parted, you know, when they parted, they didn't part in a way that, well, I've got to be right and you got to be wrong.
[00:12:50] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:12:51] Speaker B: They.
[00:12:52] Speaker A: It wasn't trying to destroy. It was just trying to. And their hearts were in the right place. And I think that's why the Bible doesn't make it clear whose side was right, is that their heart was focused on the kingdom.
[00:13:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:13:06] Speaker A: And sometimes in the kingdom, your mission, your purpose is not going to be everyone else's. And there might come a time where the water you're carrying, you got to carry it somewhere else and feed and quench the thirst somewhere else. It doesn't mean that your brother or sister is wrong. You know, God's priority is always peace among his people. Peace is going to precede any kind of, oh, I'm the minister, I'm the deacon, I'm the whatever. Peace trumps all of that, right? And when you get to the point where you're bringing in chaos and discord in the house of the Lord, you're wrong. You know, and if you can't see that, you know, you probably should take a little pause and say, man, what are we really here to do? This isn't your church. It ain't the. This ain't your ministry. You gotta let that go, man.
[00:13:50] Speaker B: When you look at the psychology behind conflict resolution, right. As leaders kind of do this, you know, we talked about, the first one is, you know, fix the problem, not to blame, but make it an. Make it a functional focus and it be an external problem and creating that unity inside.
And Paul did. The second thing was manage your emotions. And Peter.
Peter gets called out.
He really does. And I love this because he gets called out and it's like, hey, you're telling people to live under the law. And by the way, you were in the Tanner's house, which that guy handles, nothing but dead bodies.
And you're in there and you were enjoying bacon and pork chops and hamburgers, and you were eating all that good stuff. And then when people showed up, you're like, I'm on a diet. I can't have that. And you should be, too.
[00:14:45] Speaker A: And.
[00:14:46] Speaker B: And so he calls him out. Right? And I love this because, you know, if you kind of look at it and this occurs and then you notice the rest of the rest of it, like later in the chapters of Acts. Peter is a champion for grace.
He really is. So he got, hey, we're in there. He had a compass check, right? And then all of a sudden he's like, I got it. This is where we're at.
Let's move forward. And that's where, you know, as.
As Christians, as Christian leaders, you know, you gotta manage your emotions because really, it's about the kingdom.
[00:15:30] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:31] Speaker B: And keep focus.
Cool. You know, cool down and have a backup plan if you can't cool down. Right. Like, I. Maybe we ought to table this for another time. Yeah. Engage Constructively. And listen carefully. Peter had to be listening. Right. And Peter and Jesus were very close. Let's be candid. Yeah, I bet he had a good understanding, you know. And it doesn't say where Paul made fun of him. It doesn't say. And that's the next part about managing your emotions, right? Like don't fuel the fire and make fun of folks.
[00:16:06] Speaker A: No, And I think about a verse that I think is good for, especially for us as men or anybody. Proverbs 18 and 13. Answering before listening is folly. Right? And it's so easy to do that like where you're like, ah, I gotta get my point in. I got I, I, I, oh, you're so wrong. You know, this person believes this way automatically. They're automatically wrong because you have pre assumed something about them and you're missing the point. Truth without love always leads to division. And, and division is a key strategy tool of the adversary. And if you are creating division, you're working for the adversary, all of that, right. You have to learn how to compromise. And sometimes you're like, let me just hold my lips together, as my dad would say, and squeeze them in my pocket. Meaning I don't need to say nothing right now because if I say something, is it going to go sideways, going to go wrong?
[00:17:01] Speaker B: Think of it like this. I'm not going to say that I have ever looked at my wife and went, that's crazy. Have you lost your mind?
But a lot of people have probably said that someone significant.
And yeah. And it, I would really be very curious if anybody has ever responded back with, you know what, you're right, I did lose my mind.
[00:17:25] Speaker A: It never be crazy if they did.
[00:17:27] Speaker B: At that point, you probably need to get out of the house.
He may be a victim.
[00:17:32] Speaker A: You're in trouble.
[00:17:33] Speaker B: Right, right, right. And same time, you know, I've had people ask me like, are you crazy? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, absolutely. I was just diagnosed. And you know, it's kind of where we're at these days. It's called Bizarro world.
Think about that. So don't make fun or be disrespectful. You know, Proverbs talks a lot about a kind word sways anger. Right?
And if you keep stoking the fire because conflicts don't have to be, well, I'm right and that person's wrong.
Man, you see tit for tat on this social media stuff, right?
And it's, man, it goes back and forth and back and forth like a tennis match.
Hey, let's Skip that. The number one goal is the gospel. That's what Paul said.
And he goes, hey, I talked to Peter face to face.
You know, that's a great thing.
You know, Jason, on social media.
[00:18:30] Speaker A: Yeah, right. You see a lot of this on. And social media is a good point, but you see a lot of this point right here is that I think a lot of us, especially as guys, we can start man slaying, and we think that we can change someone's heart.
[00:18:43] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:43] Speaker A: And we really forget. It doesn't matter who you're talking to. A child, spouse, the dude down the road, whatever. You can't change someone's heart. Only God can do that, you know? And. And, you know, sometimes you got to ask them questions like, hey, like, I think I hear you saying this. I think I took it as this, right? And just ask those clarifying things. Help me understand. Lean towards trying to get understanding right in all your ways, you know, acknowledge him. Lean not to your own understanding. Right?
You. Sometimes you got to get to that point where you're like, I. I just want to understand you, because I think we're miss.
Misunderstanding each other, right?
A little bit of humility.
[00:19:25] Speaker B: Well, you said it. You said, I can't change your heart, but only God does.
So you got to bring God into the conversation. When there's conflict and what does God really care about? We've already. We've discussed this. It will always be a top. It's got to be a top five.
Whose side are you on? Said Joshua. Hey, man, I'm not on your side or their side. I'm on God's side.
There you go. Right? So that makes it an external conflict and go, okay, how do we kind of work together to feel the gospel? That's. Paul talked to him and talked to Peter. He talked to Barnabas. It was all about going pushing the gospel forward, right?
And that gets into, like, another step in that whole conflict resolution. They talk about knowing your conflict resolution style, right? And Colby, there's like, five of them, right? It's not important. There won't be a test at the end, but one is just avoiding conflict. And a lot of people do that.
[00:20:23] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:24] Speaker B: They're like, hey, man, I just. I don't want to deal with this. And the other is. Is they just accommodate. They just give in, capitulate. Come on, man, that ain't helping anybody.
And then there's a compromising style, which kind of got a little bit of concern for both sides. And then there's that competing style, which is. It's it's going to. I'm going to be right.
Which by the way, being right's overrated. If it cost you, cost you your friendship. It's been. It's overrated. But the last is this collaborative. And you care about the other person, you care about yourself.
You make it work. Right.
I think Peter and all of them, they had that because you show later on, they all reconciled.
The gospel speaks about him. Yeah, right. It really does. Can you imagine for people that are like, well, you know, he didn't. Paul didn't like John Mark, man, that's who he asked for. When he's getting ready to get killed, that's a big deal. Yeah, right.
[00:21:23] Speaker A: No, you're right. And I think the greatest example, and I always like to bring in the ultimate man, the son of. Son of man. Jesus, you know, he resolved conflicts very directly. If you look at it, you're talking about someone that always has some conflict, even within. Like, we're talking about our man here, Peter. He's like, hey, get behind me, Satan. And it sounds like so rough and coarse, but he's getting to the point, like the spirit that you're manifesting in this moment, where you're coming from, is not about peace. And Jesus had a quick way of just kind of getting to the point of bringing about peace. I think about the woman that was caught in adultery, the woman, they didn't bring the dude. So you're already trying to stir up a bunch of conflict. And he just gets to the point of like, look, let's just restore peace.
Any of you that has the right to, you know, throw a stone, none of you sin, go ahead. And the only one there that could have done that was Jesus, you know, and so I think when we look at his example, you know, of, of modeling how to resolve conflict and, and offenses, it's a good thing. Now I get it. On this side of eternity, we're all going to fall short of trying to be like Jesus. But if you're not striving for it, guys and gals out there, then what are you doing if you're not striving for the standard? And I know a lot of. Of our listeners understand that. If you weren't out there training and pursuing a standard, what were you doing? You were, you were regressing.
And it's no different than this, right? You don't have to go back and forth on social media, phones, or the email or, you know, it's not about your pride. You can let that, that, that P word pop up in you and get you into a lot of bad situations. There's a lot of guys in prisons and graveyards because they were trying to be too proud, right?
[00:23:10] Speaker B: You know, and I think that's important. I think these guys, by the spirit of God, because they were. They were very interested in. In. And it was very Christ focused. You know, when, When Paul was upset, he was upset that, that it was, hey, man, the gospel is Jesus Christ alone. And, you know, you don't add this. You couldn't live under the law. Now you're asking people to live under the law. It's Jesus alone. And, you know, when he talked to Peter and, you know, then of course, with Barnabas, he had the other disagreement, but he had a.
They basically kept it out of being destructive, right?
They had these guidelines and they focused on the mutual gain of Christ, which is the key component of that, right? And they said, hey, for the gospel, for the gospel, you had something pretty important where Jesus did get to the point, right? He absolutely does. But he did it in a unique way. And I don't want to be confused with. Sometimes people go, well, I'm just saying this.
And then they get their jab in, right?
That's. That's almost like the. You, you kind of respond back with real. Well, I'm terribly sorry. You just don't have any manners, right? It's destructive. It's destructive. Well, I'm just saying that you're just not that smart. Well, thanks, man. I appreciate it.
No, it's about being constructive and working together. I think, you know, they, they, they had it. You know, it's. And a lot of times, like with Jesus going straight to the point, it's not what you say sometimes, but how you say it.
No, Jesus spoke straight to someone's heart, but in love. In love, yeah. Right.
[00:24:58] Speaker A: Yeah, it's.
[00:25:00] Speaker B: I hate that phrase. I'm so sorry you were offended, but are you. Wait a second. No, you're not aggressive? Yeah, like, yeah, some passive aggressiveness. Hold that in your pocket, you know, But I, I kind of look at this and, you know, I think that even, like with Peter as a pillar of the church and some of the others, right, like, you know, they had to be prepared to apologize because it's, it's about unity. Now. I don't. I don't see where the Bible, where Peter apologizes, but you see him later talk just about grace then. Anyhow, Pete was a big fella. We're kind of convinced of that. He, he probably could have tuned him up, right?
[00:25:44] Speaker A: Like, it was probably he fought that nature. He's like, yeah, you know what, I really want to just tune you up right now.
[00:25:50] Speaker B: Yeah. Really want to hold your head underwater.
But when we do have conflict, I think it is a sign of maturity that we as Christians, let's keep Jesus at the center of this.
[00:26:04] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:26:05] Speaker B: And hey, it's okay sometimes if we have to go our separate ways.
Yeah. But we need to part in ways that's loving.
[00:26:14] Speaker A: Yeah.
You know, that's a great point. And I guess I'll give my some quick summary thoughts here is that you know, you can disagree and still both being God's will when you're talking about Christian believers. If you're arguing with the world, you are frustrating yourself and Satan is laughing at you because you're again fooling yourself into an argument that you one, you probably shouldn't even be in. Two, that you're trying to change a heart that you have no power to change. You should speak truth in love and don't try to be disagreeable just to be disagreeable. Right. Like again I talked about at the beginning of the show like people with all these signs and you know, these value sickness is in statements and stuff like hey, you're just looking for a conflict and if you're a believer you're losing witness and credibility. You know, past failure doesn't qualify disqualify you, you know, for future usefulness. John Mark, perfect example. You know, Paul circled back and could see his usefulness. Right. Just because he was slower getting up his ministry footing or whatever the case may be. It doesn't. Don't let disagreement turn into disdain.
You know, that is a big thing right now where we are allowing ourselves. Just because someone runs counter to what you believe that you turn to disdain. Which disdain is a nice little clean way of saying you hate. And the Bible is very clear about that. Right. You can't be hating and then talking about you have the message of life and love again. You see that make it make sense.
[00:27:45] Speaker B: They don't go together.
[00:27:46] Speaker A: God uses disagreements as Jason has said. We talked about a couple times to advance his purposes. What you saw that Paul took Silas, went out and did tremendous things in Eurasia and all out there. And then Barnabas took Mark and they did great things even though we don't get all the full story of what all was done. But we do get to see Mark come back and be made and reconciled with Paul towards the end. The bottom line is God advanced his kingdom the way he says he's not calling us and asking Us, like, hey, why did I have to split with that person? Well, you didn't split. If you split with the focus on the kingdom, it was a point of love. And it's like, hey, I understand, right? So sometimes your success, if you're doing something for the kingdom, you're a deacon, you're a ministry, you're whatever it is, you're having a conversation with a co worker, you're trying to understand and lead them. It's going to look like you're going to stay in the fight when it's hard. You're going to keep your lips together when you want to say something really negative. And then you're going to leave on God's terms, when he redirects you, whether you feel like you had success or they were converted or whatever you were going for in that ministry or whatever. When God says it's time to go, you're going to go. But it's all about Him.
Jason.
[00:28:59] Speaker B: No, you're spot on. I think, as you know, we kind of close this out and I know people are getting ready in the parking lot, but we also don't forget you need to introduce what's going to happen next week.
So you have to observe the shadow of the future. I love that phrase.
[00:29:16] Speaker A: I love it.
[00:29:17] Speaker B: Yeah. So it's, it's. What you're doing right here is you're trying to, by doing that, you have to be comfortable with what's going to come out.
Let's say, let's say at the end of this disagreement, two brothers in Christ Jesus shows up. Hey, congratulations. Time's up. Rapture occurs. Boom.
I need to talk to both of you.
You know, is that going to be a good conversation or a bad conversation? Right? Separate. And you gotta by. As you kind of move forward with conflict and you look at how these guys did it, they, it was all about the external conflict of piercing the darkness and piercing the bondage of the law that Jesus set us free from. Right? He set us free.
He washed away our sins. He doesn't cover them, he washes them away.
And that's what they were talking about for Peter and Paul. Then when you look at Barnabas, Barnabas and Paul had a disagreement. Paul was a go getter, man. He was, he was, he was a spark plug. And he goes, you got to think about that, though. That was Barnabas's character. When nobody wanted to hang out with Paul because he'd been trying to hunt people down in Storm, nobody wanted to. Barnes goes, I'm going to give you a second Chance, he was a, you know, he was a guy of second chances. So John Mark, his cousin, he's like, yeah, I'll give him a second chance.
I gave you one. I'll give him one.
[00:30:45] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:30:46] Speaker B: I think it's interesting that whatever the discussion, however they got to those points, the Bible doesn't record it.
The Bible only records that at the end of was they were all good.
[00:31:00] Speaker A: Yeah. And that's a great point, is that they, they wrapped up and reconciled, you know, and they focused on the kingdom.
Well, folks, that wraps up this episode of the Jonathan Project podcast. I do want to let you know though, and we, I, I mean, we are excited for this event.
[00:31:21] Speaker B: Thanks.
[00:31:22] Speaker A: Talked about this me and Jason quite a bit. We've had several conversations on this. But the topic of next week and I, I hope that you, wherever you're at your parks or wherever you're listening to this, tune in, invite a friend, invite several friends because we have Dr. Mark Hitchcock, well known Christian eschatologist, that is just a fancy way saying that he is in depth expert on all things of how the end times will move forward, as the Bible has to say.
Very honored to have him as a guest. He was so gracious to give us an hour of his time. So a very special episode that we're going to bring to you guys next week, the next recording week. So please tune into that. All right. Let the word know if you've had questions, you've thought, like all the stuff you've seen in the news, you heard. Your best friend down the street has a theory. The dude on the Internet has a theory. Well, let's hear it from someone who has spent over 30 plus years in the ministry studying this stuff out and many other things. So again, Dr. Mark Hitchcock will be our honored guest next week here on the Jonathan Project Podcast. But before that, you can find this episode, every episode at your favorite places, you know, Spotify, Apple, iHeartRadio, you name it. You can find the Jonathan Project podcast. It comes out tomorrow because we're recording this on Monday at 6am Eastern or wherever you will be at, at 6am Eastern, as I always tell you. Also the devotional, which is free, you can find that in the episode summary links. So please go and find that this week again, tell a friend, bring a friend, your mom, everyone, next week to a very special episode here at the Jonathan Project Podcast. Jason, thanks so much for your time here tonight and I'll see you again soon, all right?
