Episode Transcript
[00:00:17] Speaker A: Welcome to another episode of the Jonathan Project podcast where iron sharpens iron. Our purpose is to help men navigate the complexities of the world around them and to become the man that God wants them to be. And we take the biblical example of Jonathan and David and their friendship and loyalty as our inspiration for the show. If you want to contact us to come out to speak to your men's group business organization, please reach out to us at the Jonathan Project podcast gmail.com Again, TheJonathan Project podcastmail.com Jason, welcome. Hey.
[00:00:54] Speaker B: Hey. How's it going? Well, I gotta tell you, I don't. I'm not a big fan of the video. I've realized one, I got a lot of gray hair and also our number one fan looked at me last time. She goes, are you always going to have that, like, weird smile on your face? And I'm like 21 years I've had this weird smile. I don't know why. Now it. All of a sudden it's. It bothered me. But there we are.
[00:01:19] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. Oh, I understand. Well, I'm glad you're back. Even though we got the video running, which, you know, again, we're trying to put ourselves out there and do it for the kingdom. I want to give a shout out to. Because by the. You hear this, Veterans Day will have passed. So I want to give a shout out to all those men and women out there that chose to serve our country for all those years you've taken the uniform off, but you continue to serve in your communities around you. Thank you for your service. Thank you as another veteran out there and Jason who continues to serve. Thank you for all that you do. So happy Veterans Day. I hope you had a good one by the time you hear this. So I wanted to make sure we gave that shout out to no.
[00:02:01] Speaker B: Happy Veterans Day to everybody who's listening.
I am very thankful to all my brethren who have served as well as you continue to press forward.
Did they make you stand up in church today? Did they ask you to stand up in church?
[00:02:15] Speaker A: They did. You know, I shy away, as you know. Well, I shy away from those things. I won't be getting my free breakfast anywhere tomorrow. Nothing like that. Yeah, and if you do, that's great. I just, I have never been a person that likes the light on me.
[00:02:30] Speaker B: So me free chicken tenders. I may show up for that. Just. But I like eating them anyway, right?
[00:02:37] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. You're going to be there anyway. Yeah, yeah.
[00:02:40] Speaker B: You know, I've gotten harassed for eating chicken tenders everywhere I go. But I love them. Like, I've been to some steak restaurants, order, and I'll be like, chicken. Chicken tenders you got. And I get the weirdest looks. And I'm like, you're not paying for it. What's wrong with you?
[00:02:56] Speaker A: Oh, man, you are a complex man.
[00:03:00] Speaker B: I like, I am as God made me. So.
[00:03:05] Speaker A: Yeah, that is true. What are we talking about today, Jason? What do we got for the folks?
[00:03:10] Speaker B: Oh, Matthew, you know, the Sermon on the Mount. Judge not lest you be judged. What an incredible topic it is.
You know, Colby, when you and I first talked about this, you know, we were driving into work and.
Very interesting, you know, so.
[00:03:31] Speaker A: Oh, it is.
I've had several conversations, you know, me and you, about this as we led up to this week and preparing for this. And I had a good conversation with my wife, you know, literally about an hour ago about this thing, you know, and it's a really important topic to have because one of the biggest things that we promote on the show is being that light that draws people in to hearing the most important thing that they will ever hear, which is Jesus Christ came, died on the cross rose again for you, right? And as we used in the first episode here in season three, and I encourage you, go back and listen to it, is if you missed it, you know, someone like Gandhi who missed making that greatest decision because he ran into the wrong person who judged him. And we're going to talk about what judgment is from a biblical standpoint and how we can mess that up and really what the Bible is calling us to do, which is really more along the lines of call discernment. We're going to talk about that in a minute. But it's an important topic to talk about, no doubt. Especially in a world where we're so quick to put our judgments out there. You can just drive down the road and look at someone at the back of someone's car and they got judgments all day for you.
[00:04:45] Speaker B: They do. It was a tough topic to. It wasn't. It was a. It was an in depth topic. Right. When you and I talked about it, it continued. I did a lot of research this morning, yesterday, and there's a lot to this. A lot of the secular world takes it and goes, oh, I can eat M and Ms. Chase butterflies and ride unicorns all day, and there's nothing you can say to me. And I can hit people as I go by. Well, I don't. In all reality, you can eat MM's all day if you really want to chase butterflies. That's that's up to you. But unicorns don't exist, so you can't ride one of those all day long.
[00:05:26] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[00:05:28] Speaker B: And you may hit the wrong guy.
[00:05:30] Speaker A: So there's no. I mean, that's. That's a great point to kind of start us off with. And it kind of ties into the conversation I was having with my wife is that, you know, we miss the point. I believe too often as believers realizing that we're called to respond in love, and even more so into a deeper level, are we the right messenger? And I think it's hard, especially when you have a relationship with someone who might be in a particular sin, they're doing something that is not aligned with God's values and you want to call them out, you really, truly want to help them. But you really have to slow down and ask one Holy Spirit, is this the direction that I should be going? Am I that messenger that you've prepared to help change them? Because sometimes it's not. It's hard for people to see and hear you when there's so much history there. And number two, are your words and your motives coming from a self righteousness kind of standpoint, prideful standpoint, or is it really to align this person back to God's values? Right. And I think when you don't operate out of those principles, you haven't kind of reached out to the Lord to ask him, am I the right messenger? Help me guide my message, your message for this person. And you're really doing it to say, hey, I'm a little bit better than you, or whatever the case may be. Then you're judging. Right. And you're judging in the sense that it's not biblical.
[00:06:56] Speaker B: You're judging towards condemnation.
[00:06:57] Speaker A: Well, no, that's right. Spot on, Jason. Because Jesus never.
Jesus didn't judge from condemnation. He wasn't trying to condemn a person in the sense of saying, you have no value.
Right. And oftentimes when we judge, when we're looking at something going on in someone else's life, we are saying you are devaluing yourself. Right. Or I don't want to be with you. Use the Gandhi example again. Those people were judging him, trying to separate. Right. Which is the most common use of the word judge. When you use your strongest concordance, for all you good Baptists out there, like myself growing up, you use your strongest concordance. And you look at what that word means. It's to separate. And there's a reason why God says he reserves judgment. Because when God passes judgment and you can Find example after example in the Bible. Jason did a great one a couple weeks ago. Back. You listen to that episode about Israel drawing the line. It was to separate when God judges it is that you're over here. You don't want to be with me. That's cool. But now judgment is coming into play. Oh, yeah, we're not called to do that.
[00:08:11] Speaker B: Yeah. With Moses. Yeah. Get on this side of the line. I'm gonna get on that side. Earth opens up. So when we talked about this, I actually, even in church today, I was. I probably shouldn't say this, but the pastor was speaking, and I was actually looking in Matthew, which he was talking in, you know, first Chronicle. But I was reading in this, and I looked at, you know, we divided up the Bible in numbers and chapters and so that we could easily reference it.
[00:08:44] Speaker A: Right? Yeah.
[00:08:46] Speaker B: And I kind of outlined it and I went to, you know, chapter five Matthew, chapter five. And some of the last bit there, 43 or 42 or excuse me, 43 to 48, talks about loving your enemies. And then it says. You go into chapter six and it's like. Talks about giving and it talks about prayer and it talks about fasting and it says, hey, about your treasures in heaven. All of chapter six, five and six is that internal reflection upon yourself. Right. Like what you give, that's between you and God. When you pray, that's between you and God. It's not this giant speech.
And you know, that's sometimes when you pray, pray with somebody. Maybe it's just real quick. Right. But still, the prayers between you and God, the fasting is between you and God. But those treasures in heaven, it talked about, you know that right there. Like, those are for their. Don't worry about worldly things. God's going to provide. And then it goes into judging, and it talks about, we stop right there, which is pretty interesting. Secular world locks on to that you can't judge me mentality.
You can't judge me. You can't do this. I really wish they read the rest of the rest of it because it does talk about avoid being a hypocrite. What was it you said right before the show? You know, it's hard to be a prophet in your own home. Right?
[00:10:18] Speaker A: Yeah. Basically paraphrasing. Yeah, that verse. Yeah.
[00:10:21] Speaker B: They see your hypocrisy.
[00:10:23] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:24] Speaker B: But then Jesus goes into. He's talking about the beam, you know, the. The moat. You can't get that speck of dust out of somebody else's eye when you got the beam in your own yes. And there's some. A lot of theologians, a lot of people who have deeply studied the Bible say that. That the specific word is for like, the speck that's in their eye is the same wood that's in your eyes. The exact same type. Yeah.
So.
[00:10:56] Speaker A: No, I agree. That's excellent point. Because think about what sawdust is. It's just a component of a piece of wood, right. So when Jesus is saying they're like, be careful, you're going down a slippery slope where, oh, look what they're doing. But it's just a different component of what you're doing, right?
[00:11:14] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, you know, as a. As a team sergeant, as a former team sergeant in years ago, I remember some Odas kind of imploded. Right. And a guy one time told me, says, I.
He said, my team sergeant can't tell me not to go out drinking when he's the biggest drunk. He can't tell me, I can't do this when he's doing it. Right.
[00:11:36] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:11:37] Speaker B: And Jesus warns very heavily about being a hypocrite, about hypocrisy. And, you know, we. I did a bunch of reading on biases, too, by the way. I think one of the worst ones, when we judge people, it's called attribution bias.
What? Fire. Not the guys who made Fireproof, the guys who made those type movies. And I think it's Facing Giants is the movie. And he says, yeah, you want to judge everybody on their actions, and you want to judge yourself on your intentions, which. That's attribution bias. Right.
I believe that others make their decisions based on their character, and I make my decision based on my environment. Like I'm forced to do these bad things.
[00:12:20] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:12:23] Speaker B: We have to be very careful when we start judging, you know?
[00:12:27] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:12:28] Speaker B: But then roll into it. In verse 15, he also says. Or is it verse 15? I'm a chapter off. I was on chapter six, verse 15. He says, Beware of false prophets which come to you in sheep's clothing. Hey, man, you gotta know, right? You gotta. You gotta be able to judge and discern between them, right?
[00:12:51] Speaker A: So I think it's a good point, and I think it's good to qualify. You know, I did a lot of research and studying this week on what is the difference between judgment and discernment. And I think Jesus in Matthew 7, he displays this really well. Is that when you're judging, Right. You're coming from a place of.
For us in particular, humans judging, is it coming from a place of your motives? Right. Is it coming from that source of self righteousness. Right. Like when you gave the example, well, my intentions are good, so just receive this. And there's a reason why that Paul highlights that we're to respond in love to others around us. Right. You need to season your words. Right. With love. And it's because oftentimes our motives are just that. I want to win the argument. I want to look better. I want to put you, quote unquote, in your place. Well, that wasn't what Jesus was talking about here. And that's why he says, don't look at your brothers around you and judge them from that standpoint. He is calling us to discern, though, is this action, is this behavior, is this sin that is controlling and dominating you? I'll use like alcoholism for an example.
Is, is this aligned with God's values? Is this what he really wants for you? Right. And we have to slow down sometimes and say, am I again the messenger to bring that to someone? And it doesn't negate the truth? And I think this is where people get hung up on this verse as well, Jason. Like, well, I don't want to say something. They're. They're living their truth. Well, no, truth is not a variable person. And that person is Jesus Christ. And by telling someone that what they're living their behaviors, examples is out of bounds of God's values, what he wants for them. That doesn't mean that I'm judging or trying to separate myself from them or make myself better than them. I'm just trying to use a little bit of discernment, right? Using these terms of the Holy Spirit guiding my thoughts and actions and what the Bible says that they want for this person, but it doesn't negate the truth. And I think people get hung up on that. Like, oh, well, it's not for me to say something. No, we are to do it in a loving way. And if you're not and you get that sense, like, I'm going to cause more harm, then, okay, maybe we just need to keep our lips together and pray instead that God sends the right person to deliver the message to them.
[00:15:16] Speaker B: No. You know, when you say people are living their truth, what immediately jumps into my mind is in scripture, where it's recorded, it says, Jesus is the truth.
And I'm thinking to myself, there's really only the truth, right? Which it is Jesus Christ.
And know when you talk about this judging and if you, if, if people don't believe, everybody goes, no, I judge fairly. And I, I'm really good at this. Let's be super candid. Driving down the road. Okay, let's just. Driving down the road, man.
[00:15:50] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:51] Speaker B: Why are you speeding? Well, I got a reason. Because I'm running late. But why is that guy speeding? Because they're a bad person. They're cutting me off in traffic. You know, we're all prone to our bias and you know, nothing says, nothing negates or nothing soils the truth like hypocrisy.
You know, from. From an organizational standpoint, when you have a leader who builds his authority base, or his authority base goes outside of, you know, the structural authority, where it is anything to do, he has no more moral foundation when he's a hypocrite. Right. As a matter of fact, that costed agent is so bad, it will destroy a leader. The more hypocritical they are, people begin to notice it more and more and more.
And that's when you think about that and you go, hey, you do need to talk to people. You do have to go, hey, what you're doing is you're headed down the wrong path. I see the fruit of your tree, right? We're to discern the fruit trees, the fruit of the tree. You know, you and I talked about it. We bought peach trees. I've got peach trees that have grown really good with love peaches every year. But I also have. I purchased two pear trees, right?
And we were so excited. Took a couple of years, and all of a sudden these little buds show up.
And I look at that and I'm like, that is the oddest looking pear I've ever seen in my life.
Well, as it grows, it's an apple tree, right? And you're just like, you got me. You know, because I was. I like apples too, but I really did like pe.
But it was so I didn't look and go, wow, that pear tree is producing apples. It's apple tree, right? So as you know, the fruit of the spirit, you absolutely can discern.
[00:17:57] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:17:58] Speaker B: And yeah, I do think. I mean, we got to be very careful when we get into this judging thing. Do you know how many biases there are, Colby?
[00:18:09] Speaker A: Oh, I mean, there's probably a whole textbook of biases.
[00:18:12] Speaker B: Oh, my goodness. It's ridiculous. I printed some off.
Overconfidence bias, right? False sense of their skill, talent or self belief, Self serving bias, herd mentality. You know, we still stick to the thought that the herd mentality produces selfishness. Sure, I meant to look that up. We talked about that. You know, the herd being selfish because they don't really worry. They just, they don't want to get eaten by the wolf.
Loss aversion, framing, cognitive bias. Oh, wait, that's mine. They're mine.
But anchoring bias and so forth. Right. That they're, they're everywhere. And like you said, when God will provide an opportunity at the right season, because let's don't be foolish. He's the one who calls people to be saved. Right. Our job is to be the hands and feet, to spread the good word and to go like that.
[00:19:18] Speaker A: Yeah. And we have to use the discernment, you know, that you've talked about and we talked about is. And I think it's a pride issue. I think it is to use. One of the biases that I remember so well through some of my, my training there in the analysis world is that confirmation bias. We look at things and we're trying to confirm that I, my viewpoint, my worldview is right. And if you're from a believer, yes, I 100% stand with you saying, yes, our worldview is right. But we also have to remember something that Jesus did very well is meeting people right where they were at.
[00:19:54] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:19:55] Speaker A: And one of the best examples of how Jesus didn't judge from a condemning standpoint, but he discerned where a person was at and delivered the message to get them back to the values that him as God and his Father and the Holy Spirit want is the thief on the cross did absolutely nothing from what we get from the biblical picture to warrant him going into heaven. And for all intents and purposes, society had judged him, deemed him. Yeah, he should be separated from this thing we call life, but he's standing by the source of life. And this is really a hope for everyone out there, is when you connect yourself with Jesus, it's no step that is beyond. It's too far. You've gone too far on that step. And for humans and for us as believers, we're quick to judge and say people have this person is this or that. And I've said this, and I think about something that, you know, my dad, and we've had conversations. You're going to be surprised who's in heaven, who's not, because we put this judgment out there and that man showed great faith. The thief on the cross demonstrated a redeeming faith. Now, he got in with his coattail smoking.
[00:21:06] Speaker B: Oh, he's the first guy, though, to get the Willy Wonka ticket. Right.
[00:21:09] Speaker A: I mean, he got the golden ticket of all golden tickets, the last one kind of thing. Like, you couldn't have Cut it any closer.
But again, it goes to the point in the heart of God, he doesn't look at those kind of things the way we do.
[00:21:22] Speaker B: No. You know, that guy, it's interesting. Jesus looks at him, he goes, today you're going to be with me in paradise. And so my son and I were kind of talking about all this and I said, you know, it's amazing. The Romans used that as a huge deterrent. Like, people suffered and died for days. It took several days, Right.
But Jesus made that little prediction to that guy, goes, you're not going to last several days.
This is it today, right? Today. So I agree with you. You said something about confirmation bias. A lot of people take. They extrapolate one little sentence and they cherry pick that, right? Then it supports what they believe. Ah, you're not going to do this to me. And I really wish that people looked at the whole context of things that are going on.
You know, if you cherry pick verses, what's to keep me from cherry picking words? Well, I got a D over here, and I got this over here, and I got this. I can create whatever sentence I want.
You got to be real careful with that.
Another point, you said, and I loved it. And I, you know, for the people that saw the video, you saw my eyes light up and I'm flipping through pages here. I got to get used to this whole, you can see us. It was like magic last time. I was. You're like, there's video. And I'm like, no, there's not. I don't know what this is. You press the little button and there we are.
But I am a technological Neanderthal. So in. In chapter 8, Jesus heals the leper, right? And he asked him, he goes, he says, hey, if thou wilt, thou can make me clean. Right. I'm a King James guy. But he didn't doubt it. He just goes, if you're willing to, you can make me clean. And Jesus goes, hey, man, I. Will you be clean? It's interesting. The leper who had been shunned from society by society, you know, and whether anybody says, oh, that's heartbreaking or not, that was a legit medical. We gotta. We gotta remove people.
[00:23:34] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:34] Speaker B: Or this will wipe everything out. Right?
[00:23:37] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:37] Speaker B: It wasn't. There was no. There was no. Oh, I'm. This is sad. I'm hurting your feelings. It's. Hey, man, I'm terribly sorry. You've got this. You're no longer. We can no longer have you in the camp.
[00:23:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:50] Speaker B: And so that's why he goes, if you're just willing to, to meet me, if you're. I'm. I'm absolutely here for you. Will you. Will you just meet me? And Jesus met him and he goes, hey, I absolutely will. You know, clean.
I think that's great.
[00:24:08] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:09] Speaker B: When you do meet people, man, everybody carries. Everybody has bruises, scars, you know, from a long. And life's a long battle. They got them.
Colby, as I've gotten older, and I may have said this last time, I know you and I have talked about this over the phone. It's not about what I can carry with me in life, but it's about what I can leave behind and move forward. That's Veterans Day comes on us, you know, as guys listen to this and past it, we have no doubt, we have memories. Some people have deep scar tissues from things. Right. And however, like, I don't want my scar tissue to rob my son or my daughter of experience with dad, because Dad's scar tissue and his baggage is coming on. Right?
[00:24:58] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:24:59] Speaker B: Same thing. Like when I, I meet. When Jesus, when we meet people, there's tons of.
There's tons of stuff.
[00:25:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:25:07] Speaker B: And that's really the good news. Hey, all that's forgiven. Let's. Let's push that. Or it's all forgiven. Right. Like that's, that's between you and God. Let's. It's all forgiven.
So.
[00:25:18] Speaker A: No, you bring up some great points and, and it's a really good segue and kind of like, you know, one of my, One of my final thoughts that I thought as I was studying out this week to. Because so often we hear the critique of why people don't like Christianity or they don't believe. It's not necessarily what Jesus. I think Jesus universally would poll well with folks as far as his message. A lot of people believe it's a good philosophy, he was a good man. But where they have a problem with is when they see his followers and they attribute us as humans, our sinfulness, all the things you kind of just described, our own faults and baggage that we bring, even though on this side of eternity. And I don't expect a non believer to understand this, that even a Christian is not going to be perfect. We're not going to be like Jesus. We're trying to strive and you should be trying to move towards that. But we make a lot of errors and sometimes those errors push people away. Like we use the Gandhi example. But I want to make it clear to everyone that God is not against you. He's not judging you, he's just trying to move you again, discerning what's going on in your life and moving you towards a higher level. Let's talk about a couple of quick examples, right? Matthew 7:1:5, the speck in the law. You know, Jesus warns against hypocrisy, which Jason just talked about a little bit earlier, and pointing out others faults while ignoring ours. Right. How many people have run into believers, non believers, whoever it is, and they're judging you but they're ignoring everything they got going on. Well Jesus instead calls for that humility and that self awareness environment. Advising us in that verse in those verses to remove our own faults, to log in our eye before helping someone else. Let's talk about John 8:1 11, the woman caught in adultery. You know this Pharisees, they brought this woman out to Jesus again, a trap to him and they're trying to elevate themselves like how self righteous, how holy they are and how this new teacher Jesus is so wrong and it fueled was their motive again. And this is often when you're judging someone, check your motive, pride and self righteousness. Jesus discerned it. He said let them without sin cast the first stone. And he encourages self examination and compassion. Right? 1st Samuel 16:17, the anointing of David. Here is a man of God, Samuel. He looks at David's older brothers and he says, you know what those look like kings. They are built that way. Not this little ruddy guy that's over here with the sheep and playing the hart. But God reminded Samuel, man looks out the outward appearance. How often have we done this as believers judging people. But God looks at the heart and it's a great example of discernment rooted in humility, seeking to align with God's perspective. And lastly here the Pharisee and the tax collector, again these type of people that Jesus surrounded with. Jesus went to met people right where they were at. The Pharisees judged tax collectors. And I get it, you know, these people often from within their own ranks, their own society and they were, you know, taking from the people and making a living and they thought themselves better than. But Jesus says hey, I have mercies for their sins, you know. And he illustrates how having a humble heart and discerning those kind of things you need leads to a certain kind of grace. And you know, we could go on, there's a couple other examples but you know, really the point is is for anyone out there, especially a non believer is Jesus loves you and we gave the thief on the cross and all these other examples, and he wants to meet you. Right. And don't take that. Someone who probably is well meaning to be quite honest, and they're just approaching you in the wrong way and they probably want the right messenger miss the greatest chance that you have, which is to meet Jesus where he's meeting you, and then to elevate your life through him.
[00:29:00] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, lost people act like lost people.
[00:29:04] Speaker A: Right.
[00:29:04] Speaker B: And let's, let's be very candid about what we're saying. You're already. If you have never accepted Jesus Christ, you're already judged and condemned. That's it. It's not, oh, all roads lead to heaven. Just like all roads don't leave to lead to Walt Disney World. Right.
They just don't.
I mean, it didn't work out in any time for anyone else.
It is what it is.
You know, Colby, when you talk about judging and looking at people on their surface, the Bible's full of that.
You know, Saul, he was tall like you said. He doesn't look like it, but David was the guy after God's own heart, and he's recorded it as that. Moses had that speech in pediment. I think it's what they say.
I don't really know how that's derived from in there. I just. I think it's something I'm not good at speaking.
[00:30:06] Speaker A: Yeah, that was the part where he said that his. He. He wasn't. It's inferred, Right.
[00:30:12] Speaker B: Yeah, he.
[00:30:12] Speaker A: Because he said that he. His tongue, he couldn't speak well, that there was something going on there.
[00:30:17] Speaker B: Right.
And then look at John, John the Baptist, or, you know, not John the Baptist, but John, who is known as the disciple of love. He was the son of thunder. Right. Like he had a hot temper. He really did. And if you saw him, you would have judged him and said, man, that guy is not.
That's not the guy. And so we don't know what God can do in someone's life.
[00:30:45] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:30:46] Speaker B: And we also, you know, the whole Sermon on the Mount, as I, as I was kind of reading through it, it's a lot of internal reflection because that relationship between you and God is extremely personal. There is no, There is no group discount into heaven. Right. Like you just thought I died with some really good people. I get to get into. It's not the way it works. It's a sifting. Right. He's going to pull the goats from the sheep and, you know, all the things.
So it's all. But it's all out of love. When you don't be a hypocrite. Don't look at somebody and go, hey, man, you're completely in the wrong. But I do mind because, well, this is what my environment is, right? Like, we don't. We don't know. There was a pastor one time who made this statement that when he got up to preach at this new church, the Sunday school director would get up, say his piece, and he kind of come in at a contentious time. Sunday school teacher would set his piece and left. And I don't know if the guy that told me the story happened to him or he heard it happen, so don't hold me to it, but he said the guy left. And after a couple weeks, he's like, man, this is horrible. This guy just doesn't support me. So he went to the guy's house and he said. So he sits down, the guy's extremely welcoming, and he hears this noise in the back, and he says, hey, excuse me, I gotta go. Goes back there. And he's back there for a while, and the pastor gets up and follows and goes back there, and the guy is caring for his invalid son.
And he got ready, you know, he'd come in there to admonish the guy and say, hey, man, either get on board or maybe, you know, we'll have to find a new church. And he left. He goes, I wish I had that guy's courage. You know, I wish I had that guy's dedication, because if I had to take care of that, of my invalid child, I'd never make church.
[00:32:37] Speaker A: There you go.
[00:32:37] Speaker B: So we. We have to be very careful about the judging and realize that, you know, our job is to, you know, have the fruit of the Spirit. It's also to discern that we need to. And, you know, we're drawing people to Christ. We're trying not to push people away.
[00:32:59] Speaker A: Amen.
[00:33:00] Speaker B: Yeah, I'm not. I'm just so thankful the church wasn't looking for perfect people when I. When I went forward, you know, and confessed my salvation. Hit the table with my knee.
Yeah. And I'm also glad that churches I visit are not looking for me to be perfect. Right. Yeah.
[00:33:21] Speaker A: No, I mean, it's a beautiful point, and it's a good way to put a bow onto to this episode, is that, you know, we have to be careful as believers not to fall in the trap of trying to put ourselves into the role of being Jesus. So the Holy Spirit, which we're not, you know, and we really need to use a little bit of prayer and thought before we engage someone that we could be helpful and not hurtful to the most important decision anyone will make, which is coming to the realization that they need Jesus Christ as their lord and savior. So, yeah, awesome. Well, that is episode two of season three of the Jonathan Project podcast. This episode will be out on Tuesday on places like Spotify, Apple podcast, Amazon Music, iHeartRadio, you name it, we will be there. If you want Jason and me to come out, speak to you, your groups, you have something going on, you really want to have the impact of discussing these things, please reach out to us@thejonathanproject podcastmail.com Again, thejonathanproject podcastmail.com Jason, thanks for your time, Fellowship, and yeah, well, it's.
[00:34:38] Speaker B: Good to see you. And I'll catch you here tomorrow.
[00:34:42] Speaker A: All right? All right. Take care.
[00:34:43] Speaker B: See you, man.
