Episode Transcript
[00:00:13] Speaker A: Hey everyone. Welcome to another episode of the Jonathan Project podcast where iron is sharpening iron and we're helping men navigate the complex world around them. And we take the example of Jonathan and his good friend and future king David as the inspiration for our show. If you want me or Jason to come on out to men's events, you're having, you've had some kind of inspiration you found from listening to the multiple seasons of this great, wonderful show. Please reach out to us at the Jonathan Project podcast gmail.com. again, the Jonathan Project podcast gmail.com also want to let you know up front, we do have a free devotional. That's right, a 20 day, 28 day, excuse me, study where you can kind of add some strength, understand some different things as far as how to be a better husband, husband, father, and just influence in your community. It's about a two minute read every day and the best thing it is free. You'll find the links to that in all of our preview material for this episode. Jason, welcome to the show.
[00:01:16] Speaker B: Hey, brother, what's going on? How goes it? How are you doing?
[00:01:19] Speaker A: I mean, it's busy times as always, I think for both of us. Right?
[00:01:22] Speaker B: It's Monday and we're recording it for in the morning.
[00:01:25] Speaker A: That's right. We're, we're up against the wall, so to speak, to get this done in one hot take, get it edited to everyone's listening ears tomorrow morning. But that's because we' busy and lots of things that happen. But we just celebrated Mother's Day. So for all of the Jonathan Project podcast listeners and that are mothers, happy belated Mother's Day because it has passed at this point. But we thought about you, think about you and appreciate you.
[00:01:50] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely. Which kind of rolls us into a topic that you had.
[00:01:55] Speaker A: Yeah, it does. So I was thinking as we were kind of leading up to Mother's Day this year, I was like, you know what? What's a good gift? And I think a lot of us guys, we go through that, man, what do they want, you know, etc. Etc. And I was like, you know what, what does the Bible have to say? And really what I took away from just a little study in this week about, you know, husbands and wives and Mother's Day and all that that means in our society and families is this, is that, you know, the flowers are going to wilt the cards, you're going to lose them, throw them in the trash. The dinner is probably not going to be as good as everybody thought it was. And that memory is going to fade. It'll transform into something else or it'll trans something else. But a godly man's character and that impact that he has on his family, especially that relationship with his wife, that's what I think. A lot of ladies, if they could just chime in, if they could, they would say, yeah, that I would take that over some chocolates or anything else that you might get me. So that kind of got me thinking, you know, just a little episode for guys to, as a tune up to say, hey, man, let's, let's build off of what we just went through for Mother's Day, and how can we sharpen each other and be better husbands going through the rest of the year?
[00:03:08] Speaker B: Yeah, no, absolutely. So we are not going through Proverbs 31, is what you're saying.
[00:03:14] Speaker A: I, I, I am not in my notes. So if you, if you want to do that, you.
[00:03:18] Speaker B: No, no, no, no. So that was an inside between us. I threw that out early. I was like, oh, we're gonna go through and critique everyone on Proverbs 31. And we was like, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. That's not happening.
[00:03:31] Speaker A: Not touching us.
[00:03:32] Speaker B: So this is for the guys, right? Like, this is that continuing gift. And for the ladies that listen to us, this is, talk to your husbands about it. Let them listen to it, you know, and so, you know, we talked about this and really in our actions, we should be pointing towards Jesus Christ, right? Like, that's the first thing as a husband, you know, you gotta, you have to surrender your life to Jesus Christ first, and then everything else comes in alignment, right?
[00:03:57] Speaker A: So, yeah, no, you're absolutely right. That's the most important thing. And from a cultural standpoint, you know, a golly man is not just a gift to his wife, but into the entire household. And why does a golly husband matter? Well, a shared faith ethos, a shared foundation is what I put here in my notes. Amos 3 and 3 can 2 walk together unless they agree? A man of faith walks in the same spiritual rhythm of his wife, you become a pillar of strength, right? Psalms 1:12, 6, 7. Surely the righteous will never be shaken. Their hearts are secure. Golly. Man anchors his household in God's promises, especially the storms. I know is a couple episodes, maybe a couple seasons ago now, but Jason talked about, he brought up how if in a household, a man has a diminished role in the spiritual life, it translates, and I'm paraphrasing all the statistics and numbers that he had, but it really impacts the future Generations, your children's ability to come to faith, right? And a lot of the hearts of moms. And to be quite honest, they're carrying that spiritual load. And more and more, increasingly across households, across American society, which is what I know in particular. And that's not what's supposed to be. It's supposed to be us as men leading that.
[00:05:08] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a super interesting lead into. Because the question comes up and, you know, Colby, how do you. How does a person be a leader and a servant at the same time? Right? That's. That's almost like a paradox, right? A lot of times people go, well, I'm a leader. You do what I tell you to do.
That doesn't really fly, especially in a marriage. It's not going to fly at all. So how do you become a servant and a leader at the same time? I think that's important. But like we said earlier, you have to have a grounding that's outside of your desires, which is Jesus Christ. And always looking to him to be that quintessential example of what you want to be, Right? He is the reason we think about, like, servant leadership. It was built around his model.
[00:05:54] Speaker A: Yeah, no, absolutely, man, absolutely. You know, and it's just that father's impact, right?
And Jesus models that. That servant kind of heart and that attitude that we are to carry. And. And a faithful father models those internal, eternal priorities, right? Jesus priorities become your priorities. You know, your lifestyle mirrors his. And then in turn, you. You hope and pray. And the Bible gives us a promise as parents to hold on to you, raise your children in the fear and admonition of the Lord. And as they get older, they won heart, right? Prayer that you pray over your children. But that starts with the father, to be quite honest. You know, if dad doesn't take something seriously, kids tend to go that way as well, right? Like, they don't see the value as much as mom might be dragging them along.
[00:06:40] Speaker B: No, that's a good. That's an excellent point. You know, and. And let's be very clear, you know, man, I've seen. Where is it as a dad or as a husband or. You have to have your priorities and the priority is Jesus Christ, right? Like, I remember there was a small church and they were having this. Deacons were going to get elected, and they were like, oh, it's your turn to speak. And the guy got up and he spoke. Now, I have no idea his view on Jesus Christ, but his view on his wife was very evident as he talked about her for 30 minutes. So I was like, probably not going to vote for that one. But it was, you know, because even when you look at like servant leadership, I think that's a great example. Jesus put the organization first in the organization being the kingdom of heaven, right? And then he put others obviously ahead of himself. But in the same token as dads, and we talk about continuing to give beyond the flowers and the cards, it's. You're also not creating a very selfish person. We often society does that enough, right? Like you look at the social media is all about me. I don't mean me, Jason. I mean, it's all focused around the individual. I think as dads and husbands, you do you have to look out for your, for your wives. You have to think beyond this moment, right?
[00:07:58] Speaker A: Absolutely. You know, everything in a home especially and in a marriage has a spiritual root, right? And one of the things that I pulled out was this, was this quote by this gentleman who was talking about atheists, right? And, and the correlation between atheists and fathers. And he says that, you know, if you find an atheist, you find a person who has a wound or struggle with their father, right? And he talks about some famous volunteer. You know, a lot of these other guys that I can't remember at the time right now, but if you look at like Freud, etc. A lot of these guys, they had some kind of abusive father or father that was absent, no spiritual emphasis in the home. And then therefore it equates to. When we talk about the Christian God is as being a father, it can trigger a lot of people, right? And you know, spiritual struggles really begin in the home where a father who has failed to lead, you know, you're just kind of point blank. So it's really important to be that shepherd is really important to build that foundation into husband, Right? Just that word.
And that's why I encourage you to go and look at the devotional that, you know, Jason put a lot of effort into building out this out there because we really dive into that title in that. Because it's not something that a lot of us are taught, right? To be quite honest, like earning that title. You get married and it's like, okay, now what? Well, that dynamic has changed with your relationship with your wife and with God as you take on that new title.
[00:09:24] Speaker B: You may not have had a role model in your life that said, this is how it ought to be, right? Like you, everyone, I love the statement, we have one past, but we have a thousand futures, right? So you need to choose the one, you know, looking to Jesus Christ and looking to the example that he had. I always love the statement, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Like when I think about beyond Mother's Day and I think about putting it. Putting myself in the other person's shoes.
Right? That's important. A lot of other religions talk about reciprocal type things. Well, I'm gonna do them like they do to me. But in reality, Christianity, Jesus was the first one to say, I want you to take a proactive step. I don't want you to do a reciprocal. I want you to put yourself in debt and I want you to pay it forward first.
And he talks about that. And that's when we look at it, I think, as a husband, as a father, we have to put ourselves in the shoes of our spouse beyond the flowers, because a card Hallmark makes a lot of very beautiful things. Right.
Really do. But it's the personalized beyond that that counts. The only way you can do that is to put yourself in someone else's shoes, to think about it from their lens. Right.
Colby, when you think about that, there's guys out there and you and I talk every day, but you got any thoughts on, like, what does it mean to put yourself in someone else's shoes? How do you do that?
[00:10:48] Speaker A: You know, I mean, I think it kind of starts with something and, and for all our. Our military brothers and sisters out there that listen to us, you'll understand this where if you've ever been in a position of leadership, they talk about in particular a leadership style called the servant leadership style. Well, Jason kind of just hit on. I think that's how you get to answer, you know, your question, Jason. I think that's how you get to that point. Because one, that's what we saw Jesus model. And if Jesus models something, then that's probably the. That's the gold standard. If there is a gold standard on anything. Right. Just thinking on. On the topic itself, beyond just Mother's Day, every day. You want to give your spouse the gift of leadership, right. You want to be that servant leader in your house because you're leading with not only strength, which all of it comes innate to a lot of guys, and it can come across as domineering, which is not the case when you look at the. What God created. Adam and Eve were equals, right? And a lot of times this gets misconstrued. Right. She was the helper to him because there were gaps, blind spots that Adam didn't know he had. And God created something to match up to that. Right? But it was a relationship just kind of that mirrors the same thing with him. Like, it's not where he doesn't try to domineer and say, hey, you're going to love me. You're going to be a robot. Right. And he forces us to love him. No, he gives you a choice. But we follow him. Why? Because he has demonstrated the ability to lead. And that's what a servant leader does. You know, she doesn't want a passive kind of guy. She wants that spiritual guy. She wants a protector, a man who will pray and seek God in all the decisions that you're making for a household. Right.
That's kind of what comes to my mind to answer that. Yeah.
[00:12:27] Speaker B: No, it's actually really good. A lot of times we think in leadership, we go, you know, it's got to be my way. And it's pretty interesting. You know, a lot of people are very competitive, and it's got to be my way. It's got to be my way.
And I think back to the story about Elijah and the guy Naaman who was killed of leprosy. Right? I love that story. And we know that the Bible is very clear. There's only one God and nobody else, right? Nobody else is above it. And it says when, when that guy comes back and he goes through and he says, man, I need to give you gold, need to give you all this other stuff. And Elijah's like, nah, nope, it's free. Your cure is free.
And he goes, well, I'll tell you what, let me have some dirt so that I can put it under my knee. And he says, okay, take the dirt. Well, the story is, is they believe that gods were provincial, right? Like a principality. And he says he wanted to put it under his knee so that when he went into the false gods kingdoms or temples, he would just put it under his knee and his guy and God Almighty would be with him all the time, right? And Elijah doesn't debate it. He's like, get the dirt as husbands sometimes. Hey, man, is this really the argument you want to die on? Is this the hill you want to die on?
[00:13:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:13:43] Speaker B: Hey, man, it is what it is. Television show. You want to. What do you want to watch tonight?
Okay, I'll sit here with you and watch whatever. Yeah, things like that. I think that's where Jesus sacrificed himself for a greater good and didn't get wound up in the small things. And that's, you know, part of that thing there. I think for our listeners, for guys or for girls, the argument juice may not be Worth the squeeze because you just want to get along. Right?
[00:14:11] Speaker A: No. Right. And I think it's just being the husband that your wife truly can desire. Right.
And you're doing that through.
Through leading. Right. There's no shirking of that responsibility. Right. And it's enjoying each other. Right. But there's also coming those times where it's like, hey, you know, you're. You're acting as a spiritual cover.
[00:14:31] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:14:32] Speaker A: You're taking those, you know, abilities. It's time to put the kids down. You should be praying with them or doing family devotions, depending on where you're at. Right. Those are those desirable things that lead to and translate. Like, hey, I'm. I am taking and being the spiritual lead in the house. Right. Because.
And then it's a natural following. Right. It's just a natural thing where, you know, you'll see this. This submission, this followership, when you're leading from a place of following Jesus. Right. It just is a natural flow, and that's where you want to be, to have that kind of harmony as far as that relationship goes.
[00:15:07] Speaker B: I looked up some of the characteristics of servant leadership in this, you know, and one of the things you hit the nail, you hit it was building a community is part of it creating a team. And I thought about this. Your family is your first team, really. You know what I mean? And that's the truth. That's your team. And putting kids to bed and bath time or playing cards or whatever. Like, they take your priority. Like that is being the husband that your family needs. So along with that comes that building the community. Another key point I thought was pretty good was listening. And as guys, we. Sometimes we fail at that. Especially if you have an analytical mind. That's the truth.
[00:15:51] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:52] Speaker B: Sometimes we want to know the facts. We are Joe Friday, just the facts for the older generation out there. Right. But you are sometimes being a disciplined listener. Jesus did that in Luke 18:1 8. He talks about the. The widower who goes before the judge. And we talked about it a little bit last.
Last time and how the sharp contrast was, now she goes before the judge and she is just wearing him out. Right. And she has to go before him by herself and all this other stuff. And Jesus says, man, that's not the way it is. It's not the way it is with the Heavenly Father. So with that example where he's always listening and he's always wants to have that time with us, it's, you know, we should in turn give that back to our families to just Sit and listen for a moment.
[00:16:40] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:41] Speaker B: You know, Colby, a pearl of a joy, and you and I have talked about it, and I absolutely share this with every listener out there. I never. When I was. When my children would go to bed at night, and I knew sometimes they were using that ploy to stay awake, I never cut them off in prayers. I just didn't. I wanted to hear what they had to say. Sometimes when we listen to our wives, just listen, you know?
[00:17:02] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Just stop and listen. No, and that's a good point, Jason, because it makes me think about. Again, back to this. This word husbandry, right? A husband, right? It's a cultivation. What are you trying to cultivate, right? Is it. Are you trying to cultivate this competitive thing between. Or. It's like it's my way of the highway. Are you trying to cultivate followership of Jesus Christ and the attitudes and the attributes of that have. And this is just a question that you have to ask yourself sometimes from moment to moment, right? When emotions run high or things are getting high. But when we talk about what is a gift, right? What is that thing that fosters in that relationship with your spouse that. That kind of. To the core of this, it's. It's trying to cultivate your wife's spirit, right? Bringing out her best. That is what husbands, godly men, really do. You nourish that plant, you nourish that relationship as God pours into. You're pouring into your family, you're doing devotions, you're speaking the word over your relationship, you're acting as that shield to the attacks of the adversary, and that's allowing the natural gifts, which a lot of times translates to a needs focus. That's what wives and women tend to do. They focus on the needs of the children, the needs of the husband, the needs of the house, right? But it allows them to naturally flourish, right? And I saw a great quote or listened to a great quote, because I oftentimes listen to various sermons on Moody Radio, and I heard this one here recently as it was leading up to Mother's Day, and it said that in godly soil, which is a man, a woman will bloom, right? A golly woman will bloom. And that's. That's really. When you think about the word husband and you expand that out, that's what you're doing. You're setting that fertile soul not only for your wife, but also for your children, right? You're modeling and showing them how to cultivate the soul where healthy things, healthy families, healthy generations that can Go out and impact the world around them. It all starts with us and how we're, we're nourishing that. Right. Regardless of.
And I know and I could probably see some side eyes and guys out there. Well, you just don't know. Well, no, I, I don't. Right. But I do know we're all married to other human beings. And I also understand very clearly that sometimes those human beings can get sideways with you. But the point of it is, is you still have to be that gardener. Just as much as Jesus saw us probably and was just as frustrated like, and he kind of expressed it sometimes like, how long has he told the disciples, are you going to be with me before you get it right? So you just got to keep going, hand to the plow and keep going in that relationship.
[00:19:32] Speaker B: I think that's excellent because at some point you're, you're, you're helpmates, right? You're a helpmate, you're serving one another, but yet God calls you as responsible as a stewardship. And you know, it's interesting. I had a conversation years ago with our greatest fan and she looked at me and said, I'm not one of your privates.
And I responded back with, you're probably right. Because if it was, we wouldn't have this conversation twice. That's not a leadership, it is a technique. It's not the best one.
Right? But it's true that you have a stewardship. You have to be a good steward of it. And just like as a dad have to be, you have to live up to that position. Right? I've used this example before. When your son or sees something or does something, and it may be a crude joke, right? Or he may look at someone and go, wow, she's attractive. Your job as a dad, the role as a dad, is to look over and say, look, son, I hope one day you meet someone like your mom that is the love of my life. And don't be fooled by external beauty. This is, this is what you're looking for, right? You have that responsibility to act as a husband. You are just that. You have the responsibility to distance yourself sometimes from problems. Keep the goal, the goal and back out of it. And it's tough. It's tough. Remember, Job's wife was who was left can speak in. But as dads, or excuse me, as husbands, not only do we learn to, to listen. And that's a, that's an art. Active listening is an art. But you got to have empathy.
[00:21:08] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:09] Speaker B: I think about Jesus feeding the father. If you don't think Jesus had empathy. He fed 5,000, told him, said, hey man, they've been with me for three days, I'm going to feed them. And it flat out says it in Mark when he looks at them and then feeds the 4,000. The 4,000 are Gentiles. You know, they were like, they can find their own food.
Very clear difference now.
[00:21:31] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:33] Speaker B: And Jesus focused on the healing and that's what we have to do.
[00:21:37] Speaker A: I love it now, Jason. I think I'm going to spend the waning minutes here like, you know, just kind of building off that because it is something loving in those hard seasons, as I would call it, you know, when we're not building up to a holiday or a birthday or something like that and you're into just the rut of the year, you know, every marriage is going to have those cold seasons. Right. Just be quite honest, quite frank. But godly love chooses commitment over comfort. This is something that I know that you have conversation with your son and I have with my son. And with men you have to get comfortable. And maybe this is the army in me, but you have to be comfortable being uncomfortable as guys. You can't always be out seeking comfort. And it's something I tell my son like, don't always seek. Well, it's hot. I don't want to do push ups with you today. Well, you got to do them right. Like I'm trying to build something in you. And it's the same thing in marriage. Sometimes it's going to be absolutely feel like sandpaper in between you. You're again as a servant leader. I always go back and I try to remind myself and iron sharpens iron. You got to have Jonathan's, your life. And this is, this is one of the reasons why is, you know, guys like Jason that are my life and others, they can point you back to, well, you know, God loves us, what, even while we were still sinners. Roman 8 and 28. Right. You know, you don't think he looked at that and was like, man, this is a contentious relationship or the billions of people that are on this planet today that absolutely hate him. Right? But he still provides the sun to rise on them. He gives them breath every second.
So it's not about comfort, it's about commitment. And then just practical steps. Practice forgiveness. Colossians 3:13. Right. You forgive in your heart first. It doesn't matter what the other person does. You are the spiritual lead. Pray for her. James 5:16. Extend mercy. Luke 6:36. Seek godly counsel. You need Some Jonathan's in your life. You need godly men in your life for a lot of reason, to fill you not with worldly wisdom, but with godly wisdom. And then speak life as James said. And in Proverbs 18 and 21 mentions there is life and death in the tongue. You can speak death into a relationship. Right. And you have to be careful with that, especially with little ears around. Right. The main point is your wife's behavior shouldn't determine your obedience to God's calling as a husband. Point blank in the story. That's the way the good Lord looks at it, right? And that's how we have to take on that mantle. Put your rock on as far as relate and just start moving out. And that is a gift and within itself to, to love and behave in that way.
[00:24:00] Speaker B: I love what you said. You know, I don't always get to pick my opponent or the battles that I face, but I absolutely get to pick how I act.
And I, you know, when I think about it and you highlighted something and I think it's absolutely worthwhile noting there will be friction in a marriage. So what do you do? You know, a leader does what leading is all about. It navigates those gray times and those dark times towards a brighter future. Right? Like he says, hey, this is it. And he does it by the front. I love the story in John John Chapter 13 for guys that want to look it up. And it's right here, Jesus is having supper with his. It's called the Last Supper, right? And it's called the Last Supper for a reason. Now Jesus knows everything that's going to occur. He's known from the beginning that he is about to engage with the Roman army one on one. He's not going to fight back. And ultimately they're going to, at the conclusion of that, they're going, he's going to have pet denying. He's going to be betrayed and the guys are going to scatter. He knows all this stuff that's going on and he's going to be crucified. And he says, let's have some dinner. I want to have dinner with you guys. Think about that. If you know tomorrow you're going to die, what are you going to do? You probably want to get all the people you love the closest ones to you and you want to have supper. And it's interesting because when the disciples showed up, they were arguing. Can you imagine that? Like it's, we're going to argue. You. It's like kids arguing on Christmas Day. And you've spent every single dollar. You've got to buy whatever gifts they got. And you're about to spend it all. You're about to spend it all and they're arguing. And I love what Jesus does. He just puts on a servant robe and starts washing feet. He doesn't talk about the dirt. He doesn't look how ugly your feet are. Hey, you got some ingrown toenails, you got some fungus and you stepped in a pile of poop. He doesn't say any of that. Yeah, he just starts washing the feet, right? He just serves. He just gently serves and he washes the feet with the water. And I think, you know, we're gonna have hard times. Remember that. Serve, serve, cost you nothing.
[00:26:09] Speaker A: Yeah. And that's the model of the king. Well said. You know, and I think that's a good way to put a bow on. On this lovely episode of you know again. I know it's a little weird for you guys probably listening this morning. That's okay. I think when the Holy Spirit speaks, it's probably is probably well timed all the time. So.
As a mosquito just bit me. Welcome to Florida Living. But this episode of the Jonathan Project, we're going to wrap it up. If you want prayer, if you found inspiration, hope in anything that we said, you're going through something, remember, not going through anything alone. You can always reach out to us at the Jonathan Project podcast gmail.com Again, the Jonathan Project podcast mail.com. this episode will be out tomorrow morning, 6am Eastern or 6am Eastern. Wherever you're at on the planet, you'll be able to find at your favorite places that could be Spotify, Apple, iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, you name it. You can find the Jonathan Project podcast also in our episode summary you will find a link to subscribe so you never miss an episode and all the wonderful content that we're putting out. Also, if you want that free devotional, if you feel challenged, you want to dive in deeper on what it means to be carry the titles of dad or husband, please go take our free devotional. It's 28 days, 2 minutes of reading a day. But it can really impact and help you build into those wonderful titles that God has given us. So thank you.
[00:27:33] Speaker B: I think it, I think it's also pretty applicable to women. Maybe. We'll see. I think so. There's good in there for them too.
[00:27:40] Speaker A: It's good. It's good for all. Yeah, it's rated. Rated G for everyone.
[00:27:44] Speaker B: Rated G. General audience, general audiences.
[00:27:47] Speaker A: All right, well, we appreciate you guys. Thank you for all the wonderful support, and we will talk to you again next week. All right, Take care.
[00:27:53] Speaker B: See.
